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BladeCollector wrote: Tue May 14, 2019 5:01 am That was actually the one thing I saw coming/foreshadowed for quite a while and it actually came true.
Yes, yet the howls of outrage continue all over the internet over her turn. :rolleye:

When those complaints are accompanied by a claim that it felt rushed, then I get it because the whole last two seasons have felt rush, but to those denying the set up was there all along, I say go re-watch the entire series again. Even with the time compression now, and taking into account all her tendencies thus far, she was robbed of the two people she cared the most about in a very short span of time, Jorah and Missandei, she lost two of her dragon children, she's betrayed by people she trusted, and the man she loves has a better claim to the throne that has been her sole, driving ambition, and then does not do as she demands. That's more than enough to send anyone over the edge. Yet the whining cries of "implausible" continue unabated.
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Valkrist wrote: Well, those parents are silly because a) you picked the name before the conclusion of the series, and b) if you couldn't see where this was leading, you deserve to be disowned by your child.
My wife and I were chatting about this the other day. She doesn't watch the show, but knows what happens on it just from Facebook outrage. That was her comment, as we named our son after literary characters. We waited until the story's conclusion. It's just logical...

And come on. In this show? Literally everyone goes from being loved to being hated and being hated to being loved. This was inevitable.

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Jamie Shakespeare wrote: Wed May 15, 2019 6:23 am interesting thought on the Varys issue - he had his little bird trying to get Dany to eat - what exactly was in the food he was having sent to her ... ?
Jamie... Yes! I totally didn't pick up on that at first, only later when I read an online review of the episode wondering about that very same thing. Wasn't it revealed at some point that it was Varys that slipped Jon Arryn the poison that killed him? I didn't think Varys would be so bold with Daenerys, but as he was actively seeking to undermine her at this point, it's very likely he would resort to poison. It wouldn't be the first time someone would have tried that with her though, and I'm surprised that given the number of enemies that she has, that she doesn't have a food taster travelling with her at all times.
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Good read.... I tend to agree with the writer's argument.
Thanks for posting the link.

"Eternity is an awful long time, especially towards the end."

"What you see and what you hear depends a great deal on where you are standing.
It also depends on what sort of person you are.” -- CSL

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SPOILERS AHEAD!


It was better executed than I thought it would be minus the conclusion to Dany’s story. That was too low key for my taste. I wanted that to be more dramatic. I did feel sad to see her go though, I’ve enjoyed her story throughout the years.

I wonder if Drogon’s final scene revealed that dragons have some intelligence beyond obeying their masters. The fact he burned the throne was interesting.

I scoffed at Bran being the King when I read the leaks, but it does work better seeing it play out and he will be a good King. I’m glad Sansa got her moment to shine and became Queen in the North, making her defeat of Littlefinger more fitting.

I’m glad despite all of our issues with these last two seasons they managed to pull off a satisfying ending which means GOT isn’t completely dead to me and that when the full box set comes out I’ll feel happy buying it and watching the story all the way through again.

There’s a behind the scenes documentary that will air in the same time slot next week for anyone who is interested. I’ll be watching that.
"All those moments will be lost, in time... like tears, in the rain..."

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BladeCollector wrote: Tue May 21, 2019 5:14 am Well, lets see, I have had time to reflect...

It definitely could have been worse.

*****Obligatory spoiler warning*****
Obviously I could foresee Dany dying and luckily it was by Jon, not Arya Ninja Assassin or Sansa.
Yes, the writing was on the wall for her since the end of Ep 5, and I daresay since early on in the series, but as you, am very glad it was Jon, fulfilling the prophecy, and not Arya.
I am glad the Iron Throne was destroyed, although it wasn't destroyed the way I had hoped years ago (during the battle with the Night King, :) )
I thought it was a beautiful moment: Drogon's grief, agony and rage, destroying the throne, sparing Jon, then flying off with Dani's body. This beggars the question as to just how intelligent these dragons are. Did Drogon recognize that it was Dani's ambition for that very throne that resulted in her death? Did he decide to destroy it so that no one else could have it? Or was it simply that the throne happened to be in the same direction as the one Drogon chose to vent his grief? Guess we'll never know, but it totally worked for me.
Loved how Tyrion stood up to Dany finally, he had nothing to lose really.
After a season of one bad decision after another, it was good to see Tyrion come around to doing the right thing.
So, Dany overthrows Cersei, yay, she's the new queen, but Jon kills Dany and he's arrested because its the Unsully's city now? I don't think that is how it works. Not to mention, has it has been this season, we dont SEE ANY MOMENTS THAT DRIVE PLOT. No one saw Jon kill her, Drogon flew off with her body. I mean Jon is pretty stupid and would have probably confessed anyway.
Even though their queen was dead, the Unsullied and remaining Dothraki were still the conquering army and in possession of the city by right. It's unlikely there were enough Stark and Arryn troops alive to contest their claim on the city, especially with their commander now under arrest. As it would have taken too long for the Dornish, Ironborn, and others to arrive, the Unsullied would have had time to consolidate their position and dig in. Not like Greyworm was thinking rationally at this point. As for Jon, yes, it totally was in keeping with his personality to turn himself in for murder, no matter how justified. A small scene showing that would have been nice but they probably opted to not film one because logically, Greyworm would have likely killed him on the spot. However, I think Greyworm was smart enough to know that he would be surrounded soon so it might be best to keep Jon alive as a bargaining tool, and he was right in the end.
So, we get Bran as the new king... oooooookay. I would have preferred Jon or even Sansa. What the hell was the point of Jon being a Targaryen and the rightful heir to the throne blah blah blah, oh another useless plot device like the Night King I guess.
This was the final expected twist and mystery for the series to answer, and it came out of left field, but I was infinitely pleased by it. It was a nice tie back to Bran telling Tyrion his story in Winterfell in Ep. 2, and it made the most sense to give rulership to the person that least wanted it. Without ambition or emotion, but possessed of knowledge, prescience, and objectivity, as well as the combined history and lore of humanity, he was the perfect ruler at a time when simply placing another normal person on the throne would have meant the entire struggle had been for nothing. Bran does what Dani wanted to do but couldn't: change the system. Sansa might have been a good candidate at first, but she was already showing the signs of liking power too much. As for Jon, he was never meant to rule, no matter how many of us wanted that. I guess the message is that it doesn't matter if you are born with the rightful title, it's really up to the person and their personal desire. That Jon was a Targaryen with a better claim than Dani did serve the plot purpose of sowing doubt in her mind, crumbling the very foundation of the dream she had made for herself, and drive her further down the path of madness. It was never really about Jon... he made that clear early on... it was about what the gnawing doubt would do to her. Even if he had accepted her request at the end, she would still one day turn on him, because tyrants can never abide anyone else with an equal or better claim to live for long.
I did like the North staying independent, although I find it kind of weird that no one questioned Sansa or decided to do it themselves. And an independent northerner is king of the 6 realms?? Why did Yara have a vote? The Iron Islands are independent, and who is Davos and Brienne casting votes?
Same, and I think the others decided not to argue because when you think about it, the North gave the most blood in defeating the Night King, something that would eventually threaten all others. There was also the precedent of the history of an independent North to consider as well, and the rest of the Lords were probably so war-weary by this point that they deemed it best not to plunge Westeros into yet another war, especially one that would pit the High King against his own sister. As for Bran as a northerner, I don't see that being a problem because he himself had said on more than one occasion that he was no longer Brandon Stark. The Three-Eyed Raven was an independent entity and house names meant nothing to him anymore. Sure he felt kinship with his sisters and Jon still, but I think he could be trusted at this point to not call himself a Stark anymore and be unbiased in his decisions. Why did Yara get a vote? Probably because though the Iron Islands are independent, their approval still matters insofar as their agreement shows an unwillingness to dispute the claim and launch their own war. It was basically a courtesy to check that all the powers of Westeros are ok with Bran having the most power out of all of them. Brienne probably cast a vote on behalf of her home island of Tarth, and Ser Davos probably did likewise on behalf of Dragonstone. Come to think of it, Bronn should have been present to represent Highgarden, though I'm not sure they're exactly a political entity any more.
Who the hell does Greyworm think he is? Getting Bran to send Jon back to the wall??? I mean jeez, Greyworm needs to hush it, and not to mention HE LEAVES WESTEROS ANYWAY?!
A pissed off dude who just lost his love and his queen, with an army at his back, and nothing to lose? I agree with your sentiment, but raw emotions often distort common sense. He felt he deserved some concessions for his loss and pain, and I think on some level they realized this. Also, though he was now hostile, his contribution to the Battle of Winterfell couldn't simply be ignored out of convenience. Sending Jon north was the best outcome, since I doubt Jon himself would have wanted anything else anyway, but yeah, it was a bit silly of them to hold to that promise given Greyworm was going to leave anyway. However, if presented with a reprieve, I firmly believe Jon would have refused anyway. North is where his heart was; he found himself there, found his first love, his brothers, lived and died there. With Dani gone and his guilt and pain eating at his heart, exile was the only option for him, whether forced or not. The Night's Watch was now useless anyway, and I interpret the last scene as him realizing that anyway, and deciding to make a new life for himself north of the Wall, helping Tormund and the remaining Wildlings claim a new home for themselves.
I guess you could say, without all the crap plot holes, the remaining Starks won, Sansa got what she wanted, Queen of the North, Arya got what she wanted, to become Christopher Columbus/Arya the Explorya, and Jon got what he wanted, to be North of the Wall.

I liked how Sam attempted to instill democracy but was humorously shot down, haha.
I really liked the three endings. It actually felt more satisfying (and far less drawn-out than the multiple ROTK endings.)

I am sure I will have more comments later, but work keeps interrupting me!
EDIT:

ALSO! I think that if seasons 7 and 8 would have been 10 episodes each, it wouldnt have seemed rushed. Sticking to the story they wanted to tell, and accepting the fact that the night king wasnt the main bad guy, Night King should have been defeated at the end of Season 7 (episode 10 in my dreams). Dany would have then conquered Westeros in the first half of season 8 and then slowly fell to the madness, by around episode 8, with Jon killing her sometime in episode 9 and episode 10 would have been a resolution episode.
Couldn't agree more. A missed opportunity we will never get again, petition notwithstanding. :club:
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Jon got what he wanted after all, he was "home" north of the wall with the wildlings, they wrote it as punishment, but it was hush hush just letting him be who he wanted to be. They did have the comment about is there even a nightwatch anymore.

It is what it is now. It wasnt nearly as bad as I was expecting after the rest of the season.
The more things change, the more they stay the same.

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BladeCollector wrote: Tue May 21, 2019 7:12 am Jon got what he wanted after all, he was "home" north of the wall with the wildlings, they wrote it as punishment, but it was hush hush just letting him be who he wanted to be. They did have the comment about is there even a nightwatch anymore.

It is what it is now. It wasnt nearly as bad as I was expecting after the rest of the season.
Yeah, they also did say that they still needed a place to send criminals and other assorted unwanted folk off to, although Castle Black's purpose of watching the Wall is essentially non-existent: the White Walker threat is gone forever, and the Wildlings are not only decimated, but their raiding days are over as they no longer have the Walkers to fear.

Lastly, yes... the way the rest of the season was being handled, this finale could certainly have been much worse. As it stands, I think it managed to repair a fair bit of damage, and for anyone complaining the ending was too happy, tell that to everyone that hoped Daenerys would come around. Also, with the constant defeat, loss, and tragedy that the good characters suffered time and time again over the series, it's only right that the balance finally swing a little bit their way in the end. I'm not sure why some people seemed so hellbent on some kind of tragic ending that completely ruined any kind of faith in universal justice and karma.
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Has anyone else lost all interest in GOT?

In the time since the finale ended my interest has dropped considerably to a point where I don’t really wanna watch it again.

Maybe I’m just distancing myself from it now that it’s finished, so I’m hoping in time I’ll be able to come back and enjoy it. I guess we’ll see.
"All those moments will be lost, in time... like tears, in the rain..."

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No, you're not alone.

It kinda feels like a bad breakup, where you want nothing to do with the other person anymore, and are soooo ready to move on. Any time I see an article or YouTube video going off about GoT now, I just feel worn out and very willing to walk away. Still, a limp stumble across the finish line shouldn't utterly invalidate 7 1/2 seasons of what was still a very good show. When taken in the balance, the positives of GoT as a whole far outweigh the negatives, but a good ending was so vital to this series that we can't help but feel letdown by a rushed final season. :'(

I think the feeling will pass eventually, and we'll be able to come back with less bitterness and appreciate the good stuff we were given. I'm still onboard for the spinoff show, even if I generally despise prequels out of principle.
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I agree with just about everything that has been posted here about this final season. It seemed like they went for style over substance and trying to make a big budget movie with large action sequences and minimal plot.
Just like other movie franchises that fall flat on the sequels and fail to come up with a great ending (Matrix anyone?) and then that can put a bad taste in your mouth about the entire series. Sometimes you can look past the bad parts over time and sometimes you can't.

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I would say that definitely, the good outweighs the bad and my ill feelings havent subsided but maybe have lessened as I have had a couple of weeks to calm down and reflect.

I will say that the HBO documentary that aired the week after the finale REALLY put things in perspective for me. Meaning, as angry as I with D&D with certain storylines and how things panned out, seeing what the cast and crew went through to create this last season was unbelievable. Watching the casts' reactions during the first table read thru of some of the scenes. Clearly some of the cast did not read their script before the table readings, such as Kit Harrington finding out about Jon killing Dany AT THAT MOMENT, the life leaving his face, when he looked across the table at Emilia. Or when the producer was reading the description of Jorah fighting to the end for his queen, "taking more damage than Hodor holding the door" the looks on his face and Emilia's face got me all choked up.

Oh and for anyone that cares, and didnt see... Arya apparently leapt off a pile of wight bodies... that musta been one helluva pile of dead wights.
The more things change, the more they stay the same.

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BladeCollector wrote: Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:57 am I would say that definitely, the good outweighs the bad and my ill feelings havent subsided but maybe have lessened as I have had a couple of weeks to calm down and reflect.

I will say that the HBO documentary that aired the week after the finale REALLY put things in perspective for me. Meaning, as angry as I with D&D with certain storylines and how things panned out, see what the cast and crew went through to create this last season was unbelievable. Watching the casts' reactions during the first table read thru of some of the scenes. Clearly some of the cast did not read their script before the table readings, such as Kit Harrington finding out about Jon killing Dany AT THAT MOMENT, the life leaving his face, when he looked across the table at Emilia. Or when the producer was reading the description of Jorah fighting to the end for his queen, "taking more damage than Hodor holding the door" the looks on his face and Emilia's face got me all chocked up.

Oh and for anyone that cares, and didnt see... Arya apparently leapt off a pile of wight bodies... that musta been one helluva pile of dead wights.
No kidding, and it had to be really, really, REALLY high, because dead wight bodies would be all mushy and icky, and if you just stand on them you would just sink through all the decomposing rot, and since she LEAPT off them, well she really should have just sunk 'way deep in all the icky mess.... oh yuck!.... xP

"Eternity is an awful long time, especially towards the end."

"What you see and what you hear depends a great deal on where you are standing.
It also depends on what sort of person you are.” -- CSL

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Yes, the documentary really helped me take a step back and appreciate all the incredible and hard work the cast and crew poured not only into this final season, but the entire run of the show. Like the audience though, I feel they too were let down in the end by a couple of writers that won't even show their face now to take ownership of the unpopular decisions they made. It's one thing to stand by your work, it's another to acknowledge that perhaps some of the ideas you had were not well-thought out and poorly executed in hindsight. If there's one thing I can't stand is hubris, arrogance, and failure to admit fault, however little.

I did hear the bit about Arya leaping off the wights. All the improbable physics aside, given it looks like she's literally falling from the sky rather than leaping off of anything, my first reaction was to scream: "Why didn't you bloody show that then if it was in the script all along?!? You could have avoided all the additional negative attention that that already controversial scene had!!!" It really was infuriating to learn that they had built in a way for her to gain some height (Theon and the Ironborn did slay a fair number of wights near the tree,) but then you leave it out because a) you realize it looks ridiculous and unlikely, b) you can't be bothered, or c) likely both a and b. Just goes to show how much spectacle they expect the audience to accept and swallow without providing a reasonable explanation for it.
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A bit late on this. I had meant to update the thread when the news broke but it’s been a hectic past few months. At this point most of you probably already know, but for those who don’t:

https://www.cinemablend.com/television/ ... es-prequel

So the original pitch for the Game of Thrones prequel has been cancelled and HBO have moved forward with a new prequel called House of Dragon - an adaption of the Fire and Blood book detailing the Tagaryen history.

Personally, I’m far more interested in this prequel than the proposed original. It felt liked a retread of GOT and I never want to see a White Walker again. It’s a shame for the actors to lose out but hopefully they might find roles in House of Dragon.

Also an extra nugget: D&D left Star Wars. Again you probably already know this, but worth sharing if you didn’t.
"All those moments will be lost, in time... like tears, in the rain..."

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Yes, these news are not exactly 'new' but it still bears discussion. :thumbs_up

To be honest, the bad taste the final season of GoT left in me shows no signs of going away, even all these months later. Every time I run across an article or image of the show, I turn away in irritation. Initially I was interested in the prequel series, despite my general dislike for prequels. I felt this was set far back enough into Westeros' past that it would be fairly well insulated from the 8 seasons worth of events that we have just witnessed. The problem is, as you said, that it was going to focus heavily on the rise of the White Walkers, and we all know how poorly handled that whole thing was. Watching such a great plot element go to complete and utter waste would make seeing the Walkers on the new show feel like nails across a chalk board every time, knowing the stupid and pointless go-nowhere fate that awaits them. Even if they somehow explained the why's and wherefore's of the Night King and his relationship with the Three-Eyed Raven, it would still be an exercise in futility and frustration knowing how it's all going to wrap up.

I wonder if perhaps HBO sensed that viewers might be having these thoughts and that's part of the reason that led them to conclude that this wouldn't be a good idea. Maybe we'll never know, but I confess I would still like to see the pilot that they shot and I hope it's released one day as some special edition on home video.

As for the show that they are going ahead with, I have zero interest in the premise and even less desire to see it. For one, the events are far too close chronologically to the main show. There were enough references made and exposition dialogue in the GoT as a whole to provide a fairly clear picture of those times. Also, if you bought the Season 7 set and watched the add-on disc that had the animated history of House Targaryen and the invasion of Westeros (narrated by the original cast,) you pretty much already know what you need to. I honestly don't need another X number of seasons watching Houses and families plotting against one another for the Iron Throne. We know how it all ends, and it's disappointing. There's a big feeling of 'why bother?' in me at the whole thing, and it just feels like a cynical cash grab by trying to reinvent the wheel and throwing in more dragon-action to spice things up. No thanks. It really just reeks of desperation at this point, and more of the same with the new characters I could care less about because I've seen the future where they're all dead already and none of their actions ultimately amounted to much. GoT is the new Star Wars in terms of wasted potential it seems, and speaking of SW, that was the best decision they ever made, to get rid of Weiss and Benioff. Good riddance.

About the only thing that would make me go back to this world would be a series about the future, focusing on Arya exploring the western ocean. Unfortunately, they've said that's not happening.
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Yeh I’m the same. There were three GOT books released I. November - the art, photography and costume books - and I couldn’t bring myself to buy either even though at the beginning of the year I was looking forward to them. It has completely ruined my enjoyment of the show, which is upsetting me but that’s just the way it is.

I’m only interested in House of Dragon because I really enjoyed the political scheming in GOT. So this series will be more of that but with more dragons. I haven’t seen that animated film Valkrist. I own the book but haven’t gotten round to reading it yet. I’m not excited for it but I’ll check it out when it airs.

As I said earlier in the year, I hope Westworld doesn’t suffer the same fate. I try and assure myself it won’t because the show runners on Westworld seem like they passionately care about the show unlike D&D who it felt like they wanted it over and done with.

Val will you be checking out the Witcher on Netflix? Or anyone else here?
"All those moments will be lost, in time... like tears, in the rain..."

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Valkrist wrote: Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:06 am 100% will be checking out The Witcher. :thumbs_up

Also waiting for His Dark Materials to finish before binging, and watching The Boys, The Mandalorian, and Jack Ryan.
Just binged all of the Witcher and I thoroughly enjoyed it. Really great acting and story and it has genuine funny moments especially with Jaskier. Can’t wait for season 2 but the wait will be more agonising now haha.

One thing I liked about this first season of The Witcher was how good the CGI was, the creature design and the battle sequences. GOT notoriously cut out all (or most) the big battles in its first couple of seasons but I’m glad they had the courage to go for it. There was some controversy around the Nilfgard armour but I didn’t have a problem with it on screen.

I’ve been enjoying His Dark Materials too. I have found that I preferred the production design of the movie though, which I kinda expected as movies often put massive emphasis on production design. Also I do think the first half of season one moved very slowly but the past couple of episodes have been really exciting. The final episode is due to air tomorrow so I’m gonna be tuning in to see that.
"All those moments will be lost, in time... like tears, in the rain..."

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